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Old 12-11-2012, 05:32 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by venom400 View Post
In theory some people could start on a Zx-10 if you respect it as you say , but as a rule of thumb you are more likely to develop good riding habits and proper shifting and control on a 250 , there is plenty of time to ride , why ruin it with a nasty accident and cut your riding career short ?
Don't get me wrong, i agree with that mentality


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Old 12-11-2012, 06:09 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Rob, your the one that brought up being fast. Now it's about being fast through traffic.

I think it's funny how some of you people think that those of us that do ride on the track don't realize that most all of us learned to ride on the street first. Please, tell me more about the dangers and challenges of riding a motorcycle on the street.


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The street is where I get my jollies.

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Old 12-11-2012, 07:37 PM   #33 (permalink)
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The street is where I get my jollies.

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That's just because you are poor. Maybe soon you can borrow some of your "roommates" tip money and buy some track time and hang out with the cool kids. Or you could just spend every day dealing with the white knuckle terror, extreme challenge, and dashing display of skill and daring that we call riding a motorcycle to work.


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Old 12-12-2012, 12:08 PM   #34 (permalink)
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I should have worded that better. Let me clarify:

Obviously, any bike can tip over while coming to a stop or while at a stop. The thing with the 250R is, the relatively low height and weight are less of a factor; it's harder to drop it because of those two things. It won't get a hold of you like something heavier/taller.

I never said anything about not wearing boots or gloves. I don't know if that was directed at me or not.

-Will
We don't disagree then.

The bit about boots and gloves was just a general comment for any newbies reading the thread.

Rob
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Old 12-12-2012, 12:24 PM   #35 (permalink)
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I watched a 15 min video about some guy describing the msf course showing some things he had to do and it does seem kind of pointless; looks like most of the stuff he showed would only be helpful riding around in parking lots. Then again, a lot of drops happen in parking lots at slow speeds so I guess it is helpful in a way.
You need these skills in traffic where you often go slow, and the steering, clutch and brake control and the balance skills you develop getting the exercises really right (figure eights, for example, should be full lock to full lock and you should be able to five in each direction without putting a foot down) stand you in good stead at higher speeds. The exercises teach you control. Without it, riding fast is a good way to die.

There's an old saying - don't try to run before you can walk. Don't try to ride a bike fast before you can ride it slow.

Garibay - with respect, you have three months riding experience. Not enough t o have a valid opinion. Ride your 650 for a couple of years, then go down to a 250 and see how much you'll learn. Come back again when you're an experienced rider - about 50,000 miles - and see if your opinion has changed then.

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Old 12-12-2012, 12:48 PM   #36 (permalink)
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MSF in my opinion is a good start but it is worthless as a learning tool by itself , I have two co workers come out of the MSF only to bust their ass off a exit at the same time ,3 days of intruction are not a replacement for miles on the saddle , the MSF needs to be modified to allow riders to get the bike up to 70 mph , riding on wet floor , locking the rear and front tires , riding with a passenger (maybe a dummy?) highspeed emergency stops and swerves .

The MSF is a good start and enough ... to ride a 50cc scooter ...
The training that we used to provide covered all of that except riding with a passenger - not a good idea for anybody without enough miles to be really comfortable - and riding at 70mph. As instructors there's no way we could have students exceeding the speed limit, so it had to be a maximum of 60. Under UK rules learners are not allowed to use 70 mph roads. MSF needs to add an 'on the road' element to its courses. Ideally that should be about 70% of the course.

50cc scoots teach you a lot about traffic, but you need some skill to be safe on one. Although our 16 year olds are limited to these things they are really a bit too slow for complete beginners.

Jason - on the going fast through traffic bit - I ride to get from place A to place B in the shortest possible time. The trick, and the skill, is in riding as fast as possible without wrecking, hitting anything, being hit by anything or losing your licence. Riding at illegal speeds is fine with me and is normal. Those who don't know what they're doing either get wrecked or get banned. Those who do know what they're doing don't have any problems. The ones who bother me are the ones who injure somebody else when they wreck.

I did forget a fixed camera a few months ago, but with a clean licence that only cost three hours attending a speed awareness course. No points or fine. The last time I got fined (for speeding) was in 1981 when a lot of the 'experts' spouting their nonsense here were still wearing nappies- or in many cases were still a long way from being born.

Rob
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:30 PM   #37 (permalink)
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T

I did forget a fixed camera a few months ago, but with a clean licence that only cost three hours attending a speed awareness course. No points or fine. The last time I got fined (for speeding) was in 1981 when a lot of the 'experts' spouting their nonsense here were still wearing nappies- or in many cases were still a long way from being born.

Rob
I did not know horse riders were issued speeding tickets back then...were you allowed to split between carriages legally ? ?
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:37 PM   #38 (permalink)
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The training that we used to provide covered all of that except riding with a passenger - not a good idea for anybody without enough miles to be really comfortable - and riding at 70mph. As instructors there's no way we could have students exceeding the speed limit, so it had to be a maximum of 60. Under UK rules learners are not allowed to use 70 mph roads. MSF needs to add an 'on the road' element to its courses. Ideally that should be about 70% of the course.

50cc scoots teach you a lot about traffic, but you need some skill to be safe on one. Although our 16 year olds are limited to these things they are really a bit too slow for complete beginners.

Jason - on the going fast through traffic bit - I ride to get from place A to place B in the shortest possible time. The trick, and the skill, is in riding as fast as possible without wrecking, hitting anything, being hit by anything or losing your licence. Riding at illegal speeds is fine with me and is normal. Those who don't know what they're doing either get wrecked or get banned. Those who do know what they're doing don't have any problems. The ones who bother me are the ones who injure somebody else when they wreck.

I did forget a fixed camera a few months ago, but with a clean licence that only cost three hours attending a speed awareness course. No points or fine. The last time I got fined (for speeding) was in 1981 when a lot of the 'experts' spouting their nonsense here were still wearing nappies- or in many cases were still a long way from being born.

Rob
Are you the guy constantly changing lanes because he thinks the one next to him is going to be moving slightly faster? That shit is annoying.
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:42 PM   #39 (permalink)
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I guess where we differ is I don't consider riding a motorcycle through traffic enjoyable, sporting, or particularly challenging. Mostly just boring. Maybe if I lived in California with massive gridlock and where lane splitting was legal I would do it more, but riding a motorcycle around town really does nothing for me.
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:07 PM   #40 (permalink)
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I guess where we differ is I don't consider riding a motorcycle through traffic enjoyable, sporting, or particularly challenging. Mostly just boring. Maybe if I lived in California with massive gridlock and where lane splitting was legal I would do it more, but riding a motorcycle around town really does nothing for me.
I have been lane splitting for 2 years and over 20k miles with only 1 ticket , ironically the ticket I got on a memorial day on a Key , not going to work.

But here we have massive gridlocks , and it is quite challenging , it is never really boring riding around here unless you are riding at 2 am
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