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New rider...looking into a 650r...is this a decent price?

2K views 54 replies 15 participants last post by  williamr 
#1 ·
Hey guys, so I am looking into buying my first bike. I am a small guy 5'3-5'4. I was originally planning on getting a ninja 250 but I kind of am set on a 650. I heard the 650s are still very user friendly...correct me if I am wrong or tell me if this is a bad idea. I am pretty responsible, I have a fairly quick car with a good amount of power on tap but I dont even push that so I feel like I wont be pushing the bike too hard at least not until I am very comfortable with it.

Anyways, I went to a shop and sat on a 250...feels great, very comfortable. Tried the 650 and still feels fine, but I will definitely be shaving down the seat as soon as I get it. So in terms of comfort, I think the 650 is fine.

I am looking at an 07 650. It has 11,000 miles on it, regular maintenence and newish tires. I have seen a lot of people here with higher mileage bikes so is 11,000 anything to worry about? The cons of the bike are that it has been dropped so there is some cosmetic damage (not a big deal since I will probably drop it and I can do my own paint work), there is a broken foot peg, and it needs a new brake lever. The guy is willing to take $1600 cash, and I would be trading a 40" tv as well as an xbox 360. Without trades, he wants $2500. Does this sound like a decent deal? I want a new TV anyways and I dont use my xbox anymore. My only real problem with the deal is that there are a lot of 650's around me with half the miles for $1000-1500 more....

Any advice/suggestions? Thanks
 
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#2 ·
For my zip code the average NADA retail value for a 2007 Kawasaki 650R is $4,150. You then subtract for the repairs needed and a dealer's profit.

The 250cc Ninja or a dirt bike are better for learning, but the 650cc twin is a lot safer than a 600cc 4-cylinder for a beginner, especially if you are extra careful with the throttle.

I would have a mechanic check it over and test ride it before making a decision. Take the 3-day Motorcycle Safety Foundation beginner course as part of getting your motorcycle license, and budget for a helmet and protective clothing.

The average motorcycle is ridden maybe 3 to 5,000 miles a year, compared to 10 to 15,000 miles a year for a car, and if they changed the engine oil on a normal schedule (at least once a year) then 11,000 miles on it is not a big concern. Ask them if they used synthetic oil after the first 600 miles.
 
#4 · (Edited)
Here we go again. :thumbdown:
A 250 would be better, but common sense on a 650 is fine. It is more powerful, but not excessively fast. You are responsible for your on life and safety. I didn't start on a 250. But i didnt start out buying a supersport either. There is almost no room for a mistake on a bike. You wreck the bike, you almost always get hurt to some degree.

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#5 ·
I have seen way too many people that start on 600 ^ bikes get hurt on the first month of owning one , 2 of my co-workers totaled their brand new bikes with less than a 100 miles on them the two of them 650s , the other 2 that started on a 250s are still riding around.

buy a 250 and sell it in a year , whatever de-appreciation hit that you take will be less than buying a new bike or getting hurt .
 
#6 ·
But back to the topic, it doesn't really matter if synthetic oil was used. It matters more if it was changed on time. 11,000 is no where near high miles as long as the bike was taken care of. I would get it checked out to be sure, if your not experienced with bikes. Just to be safe.

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#7 ·
The 650 needs to run mineral oil for a couple of thousand miles to break in fully.

Some newer bikes are OK after 600 miles, but in general, as synthetic doesn't doesn't really offer that much of an advantage, it's better to stay longer with mineral or semi synthetic, and in truth, it doesn't really matter at all. I've done over 100K on a couple of bikes running mineral oil - not even semi-synth.

650s are sort of OK for some newbies who don't mind learning how to ride slow.

Rob
 
#12 ·
650s are sort of OK for some newbies who don't mind learning how to ride slow.

Rob
I don't believe it Rob, you actually caved here... this is the first time you have ever said anything other than start on 250.

Ok, OP to be honest, you are going to have a hard time learning on a 650 because of your height. You need to do MSF course before you do anything else. If you think you still want to ride, pick up a used 250 or 300 (if available by that time).

The 650 is over 410lbs wet, and the second you drop the clutch or grab a fistful of front brake, you will not be able to stop the thing from falling. When I was starting on 650 it tipped on me once when I stalled going down a driveway. I caught it a few other times solely because of the leverage using my legs (5'11").

I'm not putting you down because of your height, I'm just saying it is going to feel too big for you. You might be scared of it because of it's weight.

That one time was the only time the frame sliders had to do their job, and I was able to basically gently set the bike on it's side to regrip and pull it upright. I caught the bike midair but didn't have enough in me to pull it up at that point.
 
#8 ·
The guy that holds the lap record for 600 ss, 600 sbk, and 750 ss (on a 600) at PIR started on an SV 650. Not bad for someone that never logged the required time on a scooter, 125, and 250.


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#10 ·
Obviously there are people who are ok starting on a 650 , not everyone is this way , and if you have to set a rule of thumb then it is better to start slow , if Rob and I are wrong he will sell the bike and move on to a bigger one , if you guys are wrong and he starts on a 650 he will be dead or seriously hurt and discouraged from wanting to ride anymore.

edit: and I agree about the synthetic oil , I always run mineral on all my vehicles , it is not justifiable to run synthetic in my opinion .
 
#11 ·
The 250R is more forgiving of errors that you are going to make. You'll be a beginner; everybody makes stupid mistakes while they're learning and developing skill.

The 250R probably won't bite you if you screw up, but the bigger bikes are much more likely to. What's a non-event on a 250R (say, dumping the clutch), is likely to be a pucker moment on a bigger bike.

-Will
 
#13 ·
Thanks for the responses guys. Yeah, I feel like if the bike tips, I probably wont be able to catch it, but even if I have a 250, it will probably go down...Im short and only weigh about 130-135 lbs.

I do kind of want a 250...but it just sucks knowing that I will out grow it and bigger bikes are similar in price. The thing is, I will be doing a lot of high way (once I get used to riding) riding and I dont like the fact that I will be pushing the 250 everytime I ride. I would want something a bit quieter once I reach 60ish. I think if I take it REALLY slow, it shouldnt be a problem but who knows :(
 
#14 · (Edited)
1) No, you won't go down on a 250R. The bike's not that heavy. If at least one foot can touch the ground, the bike's not going anywhere.

2) Bigger bikes are not similar in price. One, you have the initial purchase cost of the bigger and more expensive bike. Two, insurance is more expensive. Three, maintenance is more expensive. Four, they use more gas (with some using premium, where the 250R only requires regular). Five, parts are more expensive.

3) You won't be pushing it on the highway. It only starts to loose steam around 90-95 MPH. Even then, they can go about 105-110 MPH indicated. Still fast enough to get you arrested.

4) The big bikes are generally louder. My ZX6R (with stock exhaust) is much louder than my 250R (with stock exhaust) ever was, even while going wide-open-throttle. Either way, it's not the engine noise that really gets you; it's the wind noise. Helmets are loud. I, and a lot of others, wear earplugs. They reduce fatigue and you actually hear better.

-Will
 
#15 ·
Well, bigger bikes the same year arent the same price, but for example, a newish 250 vs an early 2000 gsxr can be had for similar prices at least in my area. I am just talking about initial costs though. However, arent 650's pretty similar to insure compared to 250s? (well, my buddy ran got a few quotes and it seemed pretty similar)
 
#20 ·
Rob, your the one that brought up being fast. Now it's about being fast through traffic.

I think it's funny how some of you people think that those of us that do ride on the track don't realize that most all of us learned to ride on the street first. Please, tell me more about the dangers and challenges of riding a motorcycle on the street.


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#21 ·
MSF in my opinion is a good start but it is worthless as a learning tool by itself , I have two co workers come out of the MSF only to bust their ass off a exit at the same time ,3 days of intruction are not a replacement for miles on the saddle , the MSF needs to be modified to allow riders to get the bike up to 70 mph , riding on wet floor , locking the rear and front tires , riding with a passenger (maybe a dummy?) highspeed emergency stops and swerves .

The MSF is a good start and enough ... to ride a 50cc scooter ...
 
#22 ·
Noobs shouldn't be learning to ride and carrying a passenger. That's just a bad idea all around.

I agree that most of the drills we did were not very applicable to moving at a real speed. Some of the drill they make you do are just a bad thing to try at a real speed, like standing the bike up and emergency stopping in a corner. If you are going super slow that's fine, but so many people already crash motorcycles by putting them into the ditch because they didn't think they could negotiate the corner. They do an advanced class here that is done on a go-kart track, I assume that's more relevant to riding in something that's not a parking lot.

I did take my MSF class in the rain, BTW.
 
#24 ·
I think you guys have convinced me to just go with a 250. A few months ago I was pretty set on it but then I was convinced by a friend (who was also planning on getting his first bike) to get the 650 since it is similar in price and insurance but wont be out grown.

He isnt getting a bike anymore so I have no one to try to impress (not that that is a good reason) so I think I would rather be safe and just get the 250. Not to mention, i can save a bit of money since they are almost a grand less or so than 650's. I figure, I will want to upgrade even if I have a 650...but I cant physically upgrade too much higher than that since I am tiny and dont want much more power so at least with the 250, I still have feasible upgrades available :D

I watched a 15 min video about some guy describing the msf course showing some things he had to do and it does seem kind of pointless; looks like most of the stuff he showed would only be helpful riding around in parking lots. Then again, a lot of drops happen in parking lots at slow speeds so I guess it is helpful in a way.
 
#26 ·
Never mind that you'll be dropping a bike that is not yours, and you won't have to pay for the damage, either...
I've seen a lot of...uhmmm...ignorant wannabe future motorcyle riders...not saying 'bikers'...in a MSF class that had bought bikes before they knew how to ride one. Some of them traded the bikes for something smaller after they had finally passed the class...
It's not useless...it is smart.
 
#28 ·
Im new to riding, been riding a little over 3 months
-took the msf course
*it is of great help, knowing all the basic skills, recommend it to every new rider
- bought a ninja 650r as my first bike
*yesterday was the first time ever i've riden it on the highway (cool and a bit scary i might say at first)
-personally i think the 650 is an ok starting bike if u take ur time and respect it. I started riding it around my street then progressively upgraded to the backroads
I havent had any bad experience with it being too powerful, and hope i wont
I have had some close calls on the streets with distracted drivers, but i feel the msf course drills into u the skills like turning ur head and stuff that saved me
With that said i am 5'11" so i can touch the ground easily with both feet, since u might not be able to, it might be a bit harder for u and feel more heavy
Anywho thats my five cents...ride safe


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#30 ·
Im new to riding, been riding a little over 3 months
-took the msf course
*it is of great help, knowing all the basic skills, recommend it to every new rider
- bought a ninja 650r as my first bike
*yesterday was the first time ever i've riden it on the highway (cool and a bit scary i might say at first)
-personally i think the 650 is an ok starting bike if u take ur time and respect it. I started riding it around my street then progressively upgraded to the backroads
I havent had any bad experience with it being too powerful, and hope i wont
I have had some close calls on the streets with distracted drivers, but i feel the msf course drills into u the skills like turning ur head and stuff that saved me
With that said i am 5'11" so i can touch the ground easily with both feet, since u might not be able to, it might be a bit harder for u and feel more heavy
Anywho thats my five cents...ride safe


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In theory some people could start on a Zx-10 if you respect it as you say , but as a rule of thumb you are more likely to develop good riding habits and proper shifting and control on a 250 , there is plenty of time to ride , why ruin it with a nasty accident and cut your riding career short ?
 
#39 ·
I guess where we differ is I don't consider riding a motorcycle through traffic enjoyable, sporting, or particularly challenging. Mostly just boring. Maybe if I lived in California with massive gridlock and where lane splitting was legal I would do it more, but riding a motorcycle around town really does nothing for me.
 
#40 ·
I have been lane splitting for 2 years and over 20k miles with only 1 ticket , ironically the ticket I got on a memorial day on a Key , not going to work.

But here we have massive gridlocks , and it is quite challenging , it is never really boring riding around here unless you are riding at 2 am
 
#42 ·
I seriously think someone that has been a member on here for a long time keeps playing these games. They'll create a new account and give us a full description of what they want(most of the time a bigger bike) and see how argumentative people get because a noob is about to do a very noob thing. Because if I remember correctly every time I see a new member post they're usually a one sentence post. So if this is a veteran member and you keep pulling these crazy posts all I have to say is.... Your caught ?


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