New website app that tells you how fast you can ride for a given turn on the street - Page 5 - KawiForums - Kawasaki Motorcycle Forums
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post #41 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 10:17 AM
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For the rider crouched right down, wouldn't lowering the bike's overall COG lower the amount of lean needed?

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post #42 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 11:21 AM
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Also as far as this site goes, when would you use it? If someone is pushing their bike to the limit the last thing they should be looking at is a damn cell phone app

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post #43 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sportyaccordy View Post
For the rider crouched right down, wouldn't lowering the bike's overall COG lower the amount of lean needed?
Honestly I think it doesn't make a difference. If the CoG is shifted to the left or right of the bike it will make a big difference, but I don't think raising or lowering the CoG will change lean angle. It will effect other things, though.

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post #44 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 03:03 PM
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I would think that the lower CoG, the less lean angle is needed...but I'm no physicist.
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post #45 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-02-2013, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sportyaccordy View Post
Also as far as this site goes, when would you use it? If someone is pushing their bike to the limit the last thing they should be looking at is a damn cell phone app
Actually, it's the last fucking thing they would care to look at.

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post #46 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-03-2013, 09:12 AM
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Well the app itself is cool, and obviously the guy knows something about math/physics but real world application with it, no. Not to mention liabilities.

And someone beat me to it, the last thing I look at when I'm in a turn on the street or track is my speedo or anything in the gauge cluster. I'm looking at the apex/exit.


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post #47 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-05-2013, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
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I would think that the lower CoG, the less lean angle is needed...but I'm no physicist.
-Cody
Lower center of gravity = less leverage for inertia to fight you turning so yes it makes a significant difference. At a sharp lean you are actually leaning up or down just as much or more then left or right, you just dont think of it that way while on the bike.

Something like an HD doesnt just hit pegs at lower speeds then a sport bike, it has to work harder before it does. I dont know how many times I've been behind a HD that's dragging pegs doing the same speed I am and I'm barely leaning at all. Both of us sitting upright at the time. The center of gravity isnt much lower on a sport bike then on a cruiser, but its just enough to make a huge difference. The overall weight just makes it slower to react.

You would think that the weight of the bike effecting the whole "gravity VS inertia" thing to make the turn would be pretty damn linear. Considering that the basic math says the lean angle has to make them equal to each other to maintain the turn, that would make it seem true at first. The problem is that it isn't quite that simple since every bike is different.


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post #48 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-05-2013, 04:29 PM
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Shifting your weight alters the lean angle. You get off the bike on the inside so that the bike remains more upright. If you remain in line with the bike then the bike must lean more.

Lean angle is calculated based on the combined Center of gravity for you and the bike.

Also, rake/trail doesn't affect lean angle required to make a turn, it determines effort required to change the direction of the bike in order to achieved the desired lean.


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Yes it does btw I will give you an example.

We will use an extended swingarm in this example since its somewhat common, most of us hate them, and we all know what they are.

The first thing adding something larger to a bike does is add weight. This alone doesn't really matter, what does matter is where that weight is added. If the weight is added below the center of gravity it will lower it and vice versa if higher. We know that a lower "CoG" requires less lean angle. A change in ride height would do the same.

The negative side effects of a swingarm like that greatly outweigh any gains by slightly lowering the CoG however (if it even does).

The back tire acts as the pivot point. The tires are now farther apart then they where. This means the front tire will have to travel farther to make the same degree of change in direction as before. This means the bike will turn slower. In order to take a turn at the same speed as a bike with a stock swing arm, the front tire will have to be moving faster in regard to the lateral correlation to the back tire. This means the bike will have to rotate faster on its Y axis to make the same turn at the same speed.

Rotating faster on the Y axis equals turning faster at least as far as inertia is concerned. The bike will have to lean more to compensate and maintain the turn in question with the same forward speed as the other bike. Hence rake and trail or suspension in general effecting the required lean angle of the bike.


Last edited by weebel; 01-05-2013 at 04:51 PM.
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post #49 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-05-2013, 04:35 PM
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double post cause my browser hiccuped


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post #50 of 108 (permalink) Old 01-05-2013, 04:58 PM
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Weebel, I am not at all convinced that lower CoG contributes to reduced lean angle at speed. I think your misunderstanding of physics may make it seem that way.

Also, cruisers have a lower CoG than sportbikes.


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