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“Though fans were quick to point out the gaping holes in the Factory 2 regulations – what happens if Ducati wins a race on its 9th engine, or its 10th engine? – in practice, there is zero chance of that happening. In 2013, Ducati managed the season successfully with just 5 engines, so there is no reason to expect that they would need much more than that in 2014.”


I take this article with a grain of salt. I don’t think the above scenario of Ducati winning a race on the 9th or 10th engine is as impossible as he seems to think. Last year they HAD to survive with fewer engines, this year they do not.
Ducati is not going to burn through engines just because the rules allow them to. I'm figuring they will need 7 engines at most. The current ones, 2 iterations to optimize the geometry/location, and then at most another 3-4 versions of the engine that works. I really doubt they will try multiple engines per race or even change engines every weekend as it will take time for them to figure out how each engine works at different tracks. So 9 is plenty.
 

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They used to be a 1 championship series, now they're not, but are, and as you think, are moving back towards that with Factory, Factory 2 and Open classes. :rolleyes:

I didn't say I watch GP for the rules either, but with them constantly changing them every year, it makes on average the last 4yrs of racing pretty boring. Most often in the 800 era....races were snooze fests. MM threw some excitement into the mix for sure, which is a good thing.
How specifically did the rules make things boring? Stoner leaving, traction control, CRTs, fine. But if anything the rules are going to help this season. W/o ditching the goofy CRT rule/class, Aleix would still be way back damn near in 10th place. Ducati wouldn't be able to develop the bike once the season started IIRC. The rule changes this year opened a lot of things up.

In the 990 era, you had facotry and satellite. But still one championship and one overall class. IT worked. Yeah full on factories had more money at their disposal but at least both were not beset by a different set of engineering limits and rules. IIRC back then a satellite spec bike could have a proto engine, but may not run factory software, and sometimes (in honda's case) could use a customer spec frame vs. a proto frame.
Which is exactly what we have now. Aleix' Forward Yamaha is exactly what you just described, which was not possible without the rule change. Not to mention, Yami and Honda's factory teams insisted on the different classes and their self-imposed limits to create their own technical challenges. But at the end of the day, like Ducati, they were free to choose to go Open as well and participate in one class. And ultimately there will be one class... where we are now is just a transition step.

But now we're talking development freezes, vs. being allowed to fully develop and change things. That is one area which I don't' feel is overly fair.
How will any of this affect the action? What difference does it make? Honda and Yami's bikes are, for all intents and purposes, "developed". They CHOSE to freeze their development. Ducati needs the room to play, and Ducati becoming competitive is a net plus for MotoGP. So outside of a philosophical beef I don't really see why that's a problem.

While Ducati looked ok in preseason, it's still testing. Race 30 laps at full tilt will be another story. Even in previous years, Ducati was a few tenths off, and at times seemed to make some progress. But then race weekend came, and the bike can't last the duration. Quick at the start and for a few laps but then they'd drop like rocks down the order. Their preseason potential is still very iffy for the long haul if you ask me. Not saying they can't mix up with the factory rides, but those have the top tier talent riders as well. Cal and Dovi are not nearly in the same class, although they have both gotten better.

Mixing it up while all under the same set of rules and limits is what should be happening, not three sets of categories.
We are headed toward the same set of rules and limits. Just be patient. It's not that big of a deal. I think you are missing the forest for the trees (stressing over temporary rules while ignoring the increase in competition and action). It's not that serious. What are the downsides of this year? A rule change that doesn't really change anything. What are the upsides? Plenty. I already named them. Seems kind of pointless to focus on the negatives and ignore the positives.
 

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Get off of my lawn Dammit
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Ducati is not going to burn through engines just because the rules allow them to. I'm figuring they will need 7 engines at most. The current ones, 2 iterations to optimize the geometry/location, and then at most another 3-4 versions of the engine that works. I really doubt they will try multiple engines per race or even change engines every weekend as it will take time for them to figure out how each engine works at different tracks. So 9 is plenty.


They get extra testing too, yes? And as much as Crutchlow, Ianone and Hernandez crash who knows? :D
 

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Steve Mcqueen Wannabe!
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I have to agree with Strat - its a shitshow. And Dorna even infected WSBK with the BS class inside a class. I want everyrider on a similar machine. Not 3 classes inside....

" O yeah, I am 12th... but I am the second, open moto, factory, evo class, so I get a piece of silverware!'
 

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How specifically did the rules make things boring? Stoner leaving, traction control, CRTs, fine. But if anything the rules are going to help this season. W/o ditching the goofy CRT rule/class, Aleix would still be way back damn near in 10th place. Ducati wouldn't be able to develop the bike once the season started IIRC. The rule changes this year opened a lot of things up.

In the 800 era, there were 4 riders. Rossi, Pedrosa, Stoner and Lorenzo. Capirossi, Vermulen (both wet races mind you) and Spies were the ONLY other riders to win an 800cc era race. Every other race was a tossup between the other 4. Lights go out, Dani gets the holeshot into turn 1, is overtaken by either Rossi or Lorenzo or Stoner, who then went on to make a 7 second gap to second and 3rd place after lap 3. NO mixing up for vicotory = boring racing.

Which is exactly what we have now. Aleix' Forward Yamaha is exactly what you just described, which was not possible without the rule change. Not to mention, Yami and Honda's factory teams insisted on the different classes and their self-imposed limits to create their own technical challenges. But at the end of the day, like Ducati, they were free to choose to go Open as well and participate in one class. And ultimately there will be one class... where we are now is just a transition step.

The point is, they should have never have changed it, by adding in the CRT then evolve into the Open, and now Factory 2 class. It WORKED in the 990 era. That's what I've been saying.


How will any of this affect the action? What difference does it make? Honda and Yami's bikes are, for all intents and purposes, "developed". They CHOSE to freeze their development. Ducati needs the room to play, and Ducati becoming competitive is a net plus for MotoGP. So outside of a philosophical beef I don't really see why that's a problem.

They did NOT choose to freeze development, that's the Dorna/FIM rules for factory class. They said if you want to be a factory entry, you can't develop your engine over the year. That's kinda a penalty if you ask me. The same when they said a few years ago, each 'manufacturer' could only have 4 bikes per manufacturer. BUT they could dole it out however they wanted. Yamaha and Honda normally would split it, 2/2 (prototype/satellite spec) but in recent years Ducati was running 3 factory spec machines to try to develop the bike further. The problem with that was, the other rider was not of the same caliber and it's hard to develop a bike when the R&D data comes from someone who is not pushing it to 105% like the main rider does, but there were a few years back where the 'factory' riders were banned from testing at other intervals.



We are headed toward the same set of rules and limits. Just be patient. It's not that big of a deal. I think you are missing the forest for the trees (stressing over temporary rules while ignoring the increase in competition and action). It's not that serious. What are the downsides of this year? A rule change that doesn't really change anything. What are the upsides? Plenty. I already named them. Seems kind of pointless to focus on the negatives and ignore the positives.
The positives are only as a result of them basically customizing the grid to cater to each respective team/manufacturer. It doesn't level the playing field, it makes it impossible for the entire grid to be bound by the same set of rules, which to me is not 'leveling the playing field'. I never said the racing this season would be boring as a result, just that this season if an open class or factory 2 rider gets a win by some stroke of good fortune, it could be the same as when Rodger Maris broke Babe's 60 homer record in the season (but they went to 162 game seasons vs. 154 game seasons when Babe did it). Not entirely the same.

I see your points, it's all good, but if you are correct in saying they are moving back to a one set of rules (may take a few years) I say, why the fuck did they have to waste the past 5yrs fuckin with the rules EVERY year if only to ultimately go BACK to what they had. Dum.
 

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I have to agree with Strat - its a shitshow. And Dorna even infected WSBK with the BS class inside a class. I want everyrider on a similar machine. Not 3 classes inside....

" O yeah, I am 12th... but I am the second, open moto, factory, evo class, so I get a piece of silverware!'
I know! WSBK was the place for some great racing, excitement. BSB as well. Will Dorna take over BSB I wonder....
 

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Akai Suisei - 赤い彗星
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HRC wanted him on a factory bike. No other rhyme or reason. Ben Spies was fucked out of a factory ride out of the gates, not that he would have done much with it alas to say.
Ben wasn't getting a factory ride his first year anyway. There was no where for him to go.

IMO, the repealing of the rule is as coincidental as it was to 'help' Marc. It was dumb in the first place and never should have been put in place.
 

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Ben wasn't getting a factory ride his first year anyway. There was no where for him to go.

IMO, the repealing of the rule is as coincidental as it was to 'help' Marc. It was dumb in the first place and never should have been put in place.
yes the rule was stupid, he just was the first one to get stuck with it. Even Bautista went to Suzuki, a factory team in 2010, but got a pass because Suzuki sucked and everyone felt sorry for them.
 

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So... any tips on where to watch the motoGP aciton? the last couple years i watched it on the BBC website, but the rights were bought by eurosport which as far as i can tell won't have the video up on their website.

the whatever channel that is covering North American broadcasts is not available in Canada, and unless stuff is radically different from 3 years ago, its nearly impossible to find torrents of the races, and harder yet to get moto2 moto3 and qualifying.

really not a fan of paying $200+ for a motoGP video pass, but i guess if it comes down to no one having the races up, ill resort to that.
 

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Marquez is a damn beast..
 
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