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Discussion Starter #1
So I've been going to a lot of factory test-rides lately (that time of year) and I can't seem to find the "big" power some of these big-engined, big-$$ bikes claim. Can anyone with both cruiser and sport riding enlighten me?
I've spent the past two days riding every model Victory makes. Compared to Hardley's (which I test rode a couple of last fall) I think they do it better. Lighter-feeling, smaller looking, larger engines(?), more powerful, Much better brakes. Lower pricing, and friendlier people. If a nice dentist gets a hardley they become a "too cool to wave back" dickhead out on the road.
Anyway, I don't want to talk which is better, sport or cruise. They're different animals. I want to know where the stated 93 hp 113 lb.ft is??? The bikes are strong right off idle, and yes heavy, but my Z1000 pulls stronger from 2500 rpm than anything I could find in an American cruiser's idle to 7000 rpm range. 100+ lb.ft. is huge. Where is it??????????


I also rode some BMW's last week and had a similar feeling for the R1200R naked. Looked like my kind of bike- sport-naked, big engine. What I got was a GREAT handling, comfortable bike, but NO NO NO power or acceleration. Wimp off idle, low rev range, constant shifting, no pull. I was shocked when I checked their web site and saw it has 109 hp. Where????

My bike is no super-sport. It's heavy and clumsy around tight corners. But it's strong everywhere the tach goes.

If my bike "only" makes 72 lb.ft of torque at 8000 rpm, why does it pull harder from 3000 than a 113 lb.ft big twin can anywhere?
 

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because your bike weighs 200+ pounds less. almost half the weight. that is exactly why they feel slow. all that torque is required to get the thing moving.

also unlike a high revving powerplant the big V-Twins and singles make all of their torque basically at idle and it peters off while horsepower climbs.
 

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This is a matter of power and weight....once you are in motion, power on tap at the given speed is all that matters....simply put...power is torque based on time. power is all you are capable of feeling when you twist the gas....your body/ears can only sense acceleration.

While a Z1000 is no feather, is certainly lighter than a dressed out harley or victory....and makes far more power over a far wider rpm range. FWIW, your z1000 would walk away on an early 90's 750...its no slouch and is not all that heavy to guys like me that remember 500+ pound 750's.

And if you have even had a mag wheel from a cruiser off, it weighs a ton...far from the 10 pounds a sport bike wheel weighs...heck, the belt drive pulley on either a HD or Victory probably weight 10 pounds. Rotating mass is a far more severe detriment to accelerate.

If you wanted to pull a tree stump out, the harley would be better (force, with no speed)....it takes torque to break the bike away from a standstill. If you had a z1000 motor in a harley frame, you would have to rev it higher to let the clutch out without stalling it...

you are right...very different animals...you want power and torque, get a v-max...
 

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That Fighter Guy
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Have you checked out the Suzuki Boulevard M109R? That will be my next non-sport bike. Big engine, GSXR engine technology, big ass rear wheel, and tons of power. And half the price of a Harley.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks for the input guys. No no I don't want to buy a cruiser- I'm just going to the advertised test rides for fun. I understand the power vs weight vs gearing theory, and have years of experience in car/truck hotrodding and driving heavy trucks (2yr dumptruck/semi, 6yr garbage trucks, 14 yr bikes). But I just could not find any power in the bikes I mentioned. Yes, 700+ lbs vs my 500 wet is a big diff, but with that much more (supposed) torque, I really expected a neck snapping low end. Wasn't there. Very comfortable though. Maybe as a second bike, when my hair goes gray.
 

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The reason you couldnt feel the power they say the have is simply because they really dont have any... your average heavy ass harley twin cam doesnt put out over 80 hp.. while 1000CC sport bikes but out over 150hp and weigh half as much.

If you want to find a cruiser that actually does feel fast... ride a V-rod... they actually feel really powerfull... but a sport bike will still own it.
 

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When you rode the Victory's, did any of them have a stage 1 or 2 kit installed? I rode a Vegas and then one with a stage 1 kit installed. It was like night and day. You could cruise at 30 mph in 6th gear, crack the throttle and you'd be doin' 100mph in seconds. The guy I rode with had his own Victory hammer with nitrous. That bike could break the tire loose at 80mph.
 
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