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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
O.k. I've done 2 track days and want to step up my corner speed.My problem is mainly a confidence problem when I get passed the initial knee dragging angle.But I was wondering if yall had any tips on getting the bike to lean further when you get to that lean angle. Are you countersteering more or weighting the pegs? Is there any tips on body positioning when your down to those angles? I am a fast C group, slow B group rider if that helps understand my skill level. I know its hard to say not seeing me ride, but any generic tips would be mucho apreciated. Thanks
 

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Are you looking for more corner speed or more lean angle?
 

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you need proper suspension set up.....

then just brake later, get on the gas sooner, grow a sack... dont be scared to keep leaning the bike over.. if you lean it over and cut the corner too short then you can carry more speed.... if you are pushing it way wide then slow down and try another line
 

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Originally posted by kylbie
you need proper suspension set up.....

then just brake later, get on the gas sooner, grow a sack... dont be scared to keep leaning the bike over.. if you lean it over and cut the corner too short then you can carry more speed.... if you are pushing it way wide then slow down and try another line
Suspension setup us yes...
But braking later and getting on the gas sooner doesn't increase actual corner speed, entry and exits speed yes your correct, you don't have to increase lean angle to have faster corner speed complete oppisit. As mentioned above coner speed all depends on the entry line and finding the apex in one smooth turn, the no brake dril is the best practice and go to a conering & braking school like the superbike one.... the big part is confidence and how much brakes into the entry u use. Keep practicing with less brakes each time on one particular corner and finding the perfect entry line as that makes or breaks your whole corner.
 

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by the book:

1. find and use your braking and turn in points. If you brake at a different place every time, and turn in at a different place every time, then you have no basis for knowing how to change your speed or if your speed is consistent. Once you have established CONSISTENT behavior, then modify it by braking a bit later, or a bit earlier and not as hard, by turning in earlier or later, and by changing a bit at one time. The only way you ever get faster is by learning consistency and good behavior, Your body position is not as important as your consistency, and late hard braking just upsets the bike and makes cornering more difficult not less. I only use hard late braking to pass, it does not necessarily make you faster.
 

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Aside from experience, the no brake drill hands down was the greatest exercise I did, which actually increased my corner speed. Doing the drill with Aaron Stevenson behind me, I came into turn 1 at VIR convinced I had too much speed; but, I trusted my gut, maintained my cool, made my turn in, looked through the corner, and it was the first time I ever got my knee on the ground at the track. Aaron later pulled me aside to both compliment me, as well as give me more space because I had suddenly gotten so much faster that the guys in front of me started to hold me up. It was the greatest track day experience for me and I recommend everybody give it a serious try.
 

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Everybody has a way but I think you just need to trust your tires. The single biggest thing that helped me was a two up riding session with Jason Pridmore. IT was my first track day with the star school and he was giving two ups for downed rider fund. He would brake so late and so hard on stock tires I thought we were going to crash 3 or 4 times. Anyway if he can do it with a 200lb idiot on his back, then these tires can do it with me.
 

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at your level its all about the rider... saddle time. the more you ride the more confident you become. dont be scared to go into a corner hot as long as you know you can still stand it up and ride it out in the grass. you will be suprised
 

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Here is a good book to read "A twist of the wrist." lots of good tips for going fast at the track.

My advise is to work on body position. Also the no break drill is great! scary the first lap or two though.
 

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I have to agree about the two up ride with Pridmore...I did it on my first track day as well and my speeds increased afterwards. Realizing what these bikes are capable of gave me a lot more confidence...
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Well I got back from my track day and didn't make much progress until I had an instructor who is actually on kawiforums lead me arround and modify my lines and the next session was excelent. Thanks again Gabe!
 

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You got it, there is no substitute for good coaching. When a good coach sees a string of errors it isn't just that they can give you advice but that they know what the underlying cause for the error is.

Very often the error you see isn't the reason the rider is having difficulty. For example: in the original post about bringing up corner speed. There are at least 6 different things that can affect a riders ability to improve that part of riding. Very littel of that has to do with the bike, mostly the rider.

For example, let's say the rider has a hard time coordinating their braking and downshifting to the point it is a little bit of a distraction. That alone can make it difficult to get entry speed right.

Where the rider begins to look into the turn. Where they have chosed to turn into the turn. Where and how they set their body position. How they use the brake lever. How quickly they are willing to flick the bike into turns. When do they plan on getting back into the throttle.

All of those and perhaps more can hinder a rider in getting it right. A great coach will see which or know why the rider is making the error and be able to clear it up for them.

Following someone into a turn faster has its place in getting a feel for what faster really is but it all too often doesn't give the rider all he or she needs to be able to do it consistently on their own.

Didn't mean to be so wordy but I was hoping to fill in some of the gaps I saw and hope it helps.

Keith
 

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On the steering aspect of your question:

I steer using the bars. Shifing your weight on the bike can influence your direction, but to a VERY small degree compared to the accuracy, speed and control gotten by countersteering.
 

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One thing that wasn't mentioned and I feel is very important is to turn your head, look further through the corner and up the track. Add in proper body position and force yourself to do it right, this basic stuff always seems to help me when my riding is just a bit off.
 

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What helped me alot was going to a track with long sweepers. In my first year racing, one of the tracks on the Mid-Atlantic schedule was Roebling. Before that, I had been on relatively more point and shoot tracks. For me, when I had more time in the corner to really feel what was happening, it helped. After my first wins ever that weekend, I was faster at every track.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Yeah the main thing was just confidence, and revised lines. not just a faster line but one that allowed me to see through the turn more.
 

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Originally posted by keith code

You got it, there is no substitute for good coaching. When a good coach sees a string of errors it isn't just that they can give you advice but that they know what the underlying cause for the error is.

Very often the error you see isn't the reason the rider is having difficulty. For example: in the original post about bringing up corner speed. There are at least 6 different things that can affect a riders ability to improve that part of riding. Very littel of that has to do with the bike, mostly the rider.

For example, let's say the rider has a hard time coordinating their braking and downshifting to the point it is a little bit of a distraction. That alone can make it difficult to get entry speed right.

Where the rider begins to look into the turn. Where they have chosed to turn into the turn. Where and how they set their body position. How they use the brake lever. How quickly they are willing to flick the bike into turns. When do they plan on getting back into the throttle.

All of those and perhaps more can hinder a rider in getting it right. A great coach will see which or know why the rider is making the error and be able to clear it up for them.

Following someone into a turn faster has its place in getting a feel for what faster really is but it all too often doesn't give the rider all he or she needs to be able to do it consistently on their own.

Didn't mean to be so wordy but I was hoping to fill in some of the gaps I saw and hope it helps.

Keith
Nice to see you here Mr. Keith Code!!!!
 

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alot of good advice for you here, the no brakes drill is good. But the biggie is not letting survival instincts take over. Your brain will almost always tell you you are too fast for a corner regardless of speed, until you reprogram it. The big thing is to just push those thoughts back and concentrate on a good consistant line and pick up speed each lap. One thing, when you think you are really leaned over at a high angle your probably not. Get someone to shoot a pic in a corner and you'll be suprised at the ground clearance you still have available.:D
 
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